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Is it just me?

Jim Elston

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6 hours ago, Jim Elston said:

Is it just me, or is The S-Type ageing better than the XF? 

No. In my view the S Type is:

  • a fine wine while the XF is just another Tesco plonk.
  • an Islay while the XF is just a Bells.

The S Type gets better with age the XF don't.

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Hi All,

You have to look at both sides of the discussion.  When the thoughts by Ford were about selling Jaguar they needed a new car.  The sales of the s type had reduced while the sales of the x Type had increased.  Ford were going to sell Jaguar and Ian Callum, the Head of Design was given the job of doing just that.

You have to remember that Ian Callum had also been the architect of the design of the facelift Jaguar which had a lot of innovations from the original design, with the one you can see being the mesh grill, which replaced the "Waterfall" design.  The mesh grill is now common on all Jaguars. The first thing he did before putting pencil to paper was to sit in the driver's seat of a Mark 2 Jaguar to determine what was unique to Jaguar cars. After a while he decided, and I agree with him, that the atmosphere he felt was unique.

The XF does come with an atmosphere and its sales record does the job for which it was intended, and the Jaguar desire since 1970 to build a small saloon was fulfilled in the XE which is also getting good sales figures  Jaguar Cars are here for good, a far cry from the time in 1979 when even the Jaguar Leaper design had been sold off. 

Sir John Egan, who managed to free Jaguar from the shackles of BL cars and make it a viable entity, feels that Jaguar has moved ahead on its target of being the best Luxury car, and although Jaguar has not reached its target yet, his words to me a month or so ago were "but it will."

Having said that, I am a devotee of the S Type, and had wanted one since I saw a good friend of mine restoring a Mark 1.  I had to wait till 2013 and I would love to buy one of the newly engineered S Types that was Ian Callum last design, but selling our house is not an option.




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The S-type is a great car and with more retro looks

when the XF was first released it was just a rebodied S-type, with the electronics just upgraded, it used S-type floor pan, complete with all suspension

the S-type is really quite a comfortable car and in S-type R form powerfull and quick

Every time I use mine it allways manages to put a big grin on my face





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On 9/11/2018 at 7:55 AM, cubist said:

No. In my view the S Type is:

  • a fine wine while the XF is just another Tesco plonk.
  • an Islay while the XF is just a Bells.

The S Type gets better with age the XF don't.

Advancing years, dyslexic digits, in too much of a hurry - I did mean YES, honest.:wheelchair:

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Any resemblance between myself and any person living or deceased, sit-com character, or abscondee from the nearby afterlife ushers is purely coincidental and I accept no liability for breach of copyright, IPR or any other infringement of law civil and criminal nor shall I be held liable to acts of vengeance visited by means of fire breathing behemoths. No, no, no, no.....well OK then its a fair cop.

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I too find excuses to re visit the especially concreted parking area at our home to re view the S- Type !! I could not appreciate the lines of the car design on our conventional drive - which now only has my long suffering wife's RAV 4 on it. The new parking area (May 2018) cost me as much as I had paid for the Jag in Dec 2017 !! I can view the car from my office window and the master bedroom, are we all nuts? So much better though - I can lavish care, continual leathering, internal leather feed - overall polishing all in an area where I could now park two S - Types !! - Well you never know.

Taking her to Duxford - The Battle of Britain Air Show on Sept 23rd - Gold Pass VIP adjacent parking - with the number plate of FLY 11 1T she will look great - Can't wait !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Look after 'em - a rare marque and a rarer model !



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12 hours ago, cubist said:

nor shall I be held liable to acts of vengeance visited by means of fire breathing behemoths. No, no, no, no.....well OK then its a fair cop.

Fortunately, Steve, Claude is having issues with his GPS and was last seen explaining why wisps of smoke were visible from the local shopping centre which once hosted Maplins, Comet, BHS, Toys R Us etc., all of which have gone up in smoke, possibly due to unauthorised marketing of Welsh memorabilia.  Claude enjoyed visiting as he commented that the floor assistants usually had "dragon breath", particularly on a Monday morning.    As a result of the aforesaid GPS issues, he may have by-passed your abode, although Black Bess may well appear on his dashcam footage.

Meanwhile, reference the "afterlife ushers", we have recently gone quiet on the forum due, in equal measures, to spending our time spoodling Purrrdy (our XJS) and also watching our box set of "In Loving Memory" to see if we could pick up any tips.

Finally, much agreement reference the classic credentials of the S-type.  Our '07 run-out in Seafrost with Barley trim is an (almost) daily driver but receives as much attention from us as the XJS and X150.   



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  • 2 weeks later...
On 9/11/2018 at 2:04 AM, Jim Elston said:

Is it just me, or is The S-Type ageing better than the XF?

No, that is the objective and universal truth. 🙂 The first time I saw the XF and XE, I thought they were Chryslers. They're ugly and in my honest opinion the last good looking Jaguars were the XK8 pre-facelift and the S-Type.

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Ian Callum had a big job on his hands when he was asked  to take over the job of Design Director after the death of Geoff Lawson.  While he was and still is an admirer of the S Type quite a few people did not like the retro design and some did not think that the S Type was suitable for a medium sized luxury car.  There is much in the XF from the S Type apart from engines  ---  the steering, the brakes, and the suspension, all of which are well tested.  The mesh radiator grill on the face lifted s type is now common on all Jaguars. Ian Callum did listen to comment, and while there is some opinion of the exterior design of the XF, it has proved to be a good base for the SUV which again was built for those who wanted  that type of car.

If you do look at the XF, and its smaller and larger family, and you make a comparison with the S Type, you will see that theXF carries some of the characteristics, with the main one being the atmosphere.  The XF certainly has that!



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  • 4 weeks later...

Some friends in France are planning to buy a new car. They're well heeled and looking at some expensive options, but didn't mention Jaguar. When I asked why the marque was not on their shortlist the lady responded "If they made a car like yours I would buy it but the new ones are just normal". The word 'normal' in France interprets as indistinct from anything else, run-of-the-mill.

C'est la vie.

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